Automated Home Forums http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/ On the web since 1996, Automated Home is the centre of the UK Smart Home community. Our most popular features are the regularly updated News Section, Reviews, Wiring Guide, Mailing List and these Forums - www.AutomatedHome.co.uk en Thu, 09 Sep 2010 09:15:30 GMT vBulletin 30 http://www.automatedhome.co.ukhttp://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/images/misc/rss.jpg Automated Home Forums http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/ A bit of 1-wire wire help please. http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2530&goto=newpost Thu, 09 Sep 2010 08:55:50 GMT ---Quote (Originally by Collectors)--- Thanks guys, but the room temp i should be able to sort in a similar way to Quinten has done. But there will...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Collectors (Post 11207)
Thanks guys, but the room temp i should be able to sort in a similar way to Quinten has done. But there will be about 8 points that may have temperatures up to 100c & wont be able to run the cat 5 near this. This is where i wanted to make up some 2 meter fly leads with silicon heat proof cable with a DS1822 on the end. But wasn't sure if i should run 3 core only down the lead or 3 in & 3 out from the DS1822.
Sorry to dig-up an old thread but this is exactly the same question as I have now...
I am using 1-wire for CH zone control so am looking to put temp sensors (DS18B20) in several rooms. An initial thought is to drop the sensor plus cable down an existing conduit (to get them to a more representative height in the room) and join it to the 1-wire bus above the ceiling.

Looking at Maxim's Reliable Long 1-wire Networks doc (http://pdfserv.maxim-ic.com/en/an/AN148.pdf) they call these drops to the sensors "stubs". They call the network a "linear topology" (page 2) if the stubs are shorter than 3m or a "stubbed topology" (page 3) if longer.

It would appear that the linear topology will give the most reliability, and possibly the 3m value is fairly arbitrary.

The standard 1-wire RJ45 wiring seems to be:
1=GND (power)
2=Vdd 5V
3=? GND or not connected?
4=DQ
5=GND (data)
6=not connected
7=unregulated 12-24V
8=GND unreg

So, like Collector, I was also thinking should I drop the DQ and GND down to the sensor and then "back up" again - in other words, passing the network via the sensor so that there is no stub?

The advantage of this is that you reduce the number of stubs. The disadvantage is that you increase the length of the network ("radius" in Dallas/Maxim terminology) by, say 3-4m, per drop.

Assuming I only want to drop one, not two, CAT5 cables to the sensor (I'm using the Clipsal pink cable which isn't too big) is this a good idea? If so, what pins/cores do people use? You'd want DQ/GND on another pair so "incoming" could be 4+5 and "outgoing" could be 3+6? Then the ceiling/void bus connector would have 3 RJ45s with 2 "bus" sockets and one "sensor" socket. All would have 2, 7 & 8 connected. "Bus" A would have 4 connected to "sensor" 4 and 5 connected to "sensor" 5. "Bus" B would have 4 connected to "sensor" 6 and 5 connected to "sensor" 3. The sensor end, or a bridge made from an RJ45 plug if no sensor fitted, would connect 3 to 5 (GND) and 4 to 6 (DQ).

Of course if you put sensors in the ceiling, like Quinten has, this is a non-issue :) . However there may still be situations where you really want to branch off the 1-wire network only running one cable where this technique would be better.

By the way, where did you get your little PCBs from Quinten?


Simon ]]> General Discussion Simon300 http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2530 <![CDATA[External PIR-s constantly 'on', Alarm Pro night mode problem]]> http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2845&goto=newpost Thu, 09 Sep 2010 07:58:09 GMT Karam,
I have just performed the analysis and I'm sending You the results below. The PIR indicator didn't go off after the the analysis and it didn't go off after a network stop and restart.
Two faulty PIRs are connected to inputs 1 and 2 of this ODI.
On input 3, there's a rain detector that seems to be working correctly. When I mesured the inputs with a multimeter, they were showing ca. 40 ohm resistance. Short-circuiting the inputs with a wire didn't change the state of the input.
The same problem happens with another ODI in my network.


Here is the analysis result:

Name= 100C Wejścia cyfrowe 3
Version
Master firmware version= 10
Year= 08
Month= 03
Day= 07
Slave firmware version= 00
Variant= 1
Hardware ID= 022
OS Parameters
Max NIDs= 01
NID 01= 100C
Max ZIDs= 02
ZID 01= 00
ZID 02= 00
Max TIDs= 02
TID 01= 12 General Digital input
TID 02= 12 General Digital input
Max NIDMASKs= 00
Min bit rate= 13
Max len bytes-1/max bit rate exp= 01
Receive Buffer Length= 3C
Transmit Buffer Length= 1B
Bit Rate Setting= 2E
Reset status=00
Module (general)
Par#0= 00
Vector 01 (Init)
Addr=FFFF
EX
Par#0= 0B
Par#1= 07
Par#3= 00
Par#4= 14
Vector 01
Addr=FFFF
Vector 02
Addr=FFFF
Vector 03
Addr=FFFF
Vector 04
Addr=FFFF
Vector 05
Addr=FFFF
Vector 06
Addr=FFFF
Vector 07
Addr=FFFF
Vector 08
Addr=FFFF ]]> Idratek stachoo http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2845 Turning off the PIR tell-tale LED http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2847&goto=newpost Thu, 09 Sep 2010 06:54:00 GMT Thanks Karam.

Gumby, can you update the FAQ please? I'm sure I won't be the last to have a six year old throw a wobbler at bedtime because "he's scared of the sensor", no matter how logical the explanation! :rolleyes: ]]> Idratek __CA__ http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2847 Huge Saving on Home CCTV Kits - Limited Offer http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2846&goto=newpost Wed, 08 Sep 2010 19:15:36 GMT Hi all, From today we are offering the following cctv kit at an incredible price, this is a limited deal and ends when stock runs out. *Special... Hi all,

From today we are offering the following cctv kit at an incredible price, this is a limited deal and ends when stock runs out.

Special Price of £200

CnM CCTV SECURITY SYSTEM
-4 Night and Day waterproof Cameras
-500GB DVR (1 month solid Recording)
-All the Cables needed to connect



This is the cheapest price you will find this system anywhere and is only for a limited time.

Pack Contents:


4-channel DVR
500GB hard drive (pre-installed)
4 x outdoor colour cameras
4 x 18m camera cables
4 x mounting brackets
Power adaptor
5-way power splitter
USB cable
Remote Control
PS/2 Mouse
BNC-Scart Cable (No need for CCTV Monitor! Use your TV)
Instruction manual

Main Features:



Complete security solution

Includes four day / night colour outdoor cameras and DVR with pre-installed 500GB hard drive and remote control
Monitor and record up to 4 cameras simultaneously
Cameras have up to 5m night vision range
Easy installation with set and forget operation
Built in removable HDD rack for quick swap hard drive
High quality colour video at 30 fps recording / playback quad mode
USB 2.0 connection for fast backup of video to PC
Motion detection and video loss alarm function
Use with any TV or monitor
Perfect monitoring and camera solution for any home or business

Connect directly to your PC/Laptop via USB (Standard USB Cable: Not included) to view and monitor streams - manage the device through your PC and save AVI files to your computer with ease. Alternatively, connect directly to your monitor (BNC Connection) or TV and manage the device with the included remote. ]]> Commercial Offers L33tbox http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2846 Sensing if a device is on / standby / off http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2841&goto=newpost Wed, 08 Sep 2010 08:46:16 GMT ---Quote (Originally by Paul_B)--- when does most HA ever pay for itself ... Paul ---End Quote--- the data, assuming your device is similar, seems...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul_B (Post 13074)
when does most HA ever pay for itself ... Paul
the data, assuming your device is similar, seems to show you might save getting-on for £40pa, less something for it no longer helping to heat your house in winter ... it would soon add up ! ]]> Idratek chris_j_hunter http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2841 xAP on the Joggler http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2758&goto=newpost Wed, 08 Sep 2010 06:50:30 GMT ---Quote (Originally by Kevin)--- ... Would it not be easier to create a small xAP application that ran on the Joggler that sent the file content...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin (Post 13068)
...
Would it not be easier to create a small xAP application that ran on the Joggler that sent the file content out as an OSD message when it had changed ?
Yes, I was wondering about that approach too - I need some kind of 1-wire to xAP gateway. HomeSeer seems to have the best support but I really don't want to go that far yet - maybe for now I can come up with something that calls digitemp and then broadcasts an xAP message in response. I'll have a look at those supporting libraries for opn-one for inspiration. ]]> xAP Simon300 http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2758 Conrad heating units http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2844&goto=newpost Tue, 07 Sep 2010 15:53:21 GMT I'm thinking of automating my heating using the conrad kit....

FHZ1000 - controller
FHT80B - thermostats
FHT8V - Actuators
FHT8W - Boiler controller

Does this setup look correct.

I hope once all the thermostats are in place and configured to use the FHZ1000 to fine tune them from a single point. The boiler will only be in use when one or more thermostats require heat.

Is it correct the FHT80B's do not show the current temperature.

I believe the FHT80B conrad sells is an FHT80B-II

I have seen while browsing reference to an FHT80B-III but it was in german. Anyone know anything about this.

Do these units have the capability to have their firmware upgraded. ]]> Heating Control nappyshock http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2844 Mounting patch panels ... http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2832&goto=newpost Tue, 07 Sep 2010 14:09:14 GMT
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFluffy (Post 13063)
You can get the 10" mini patch panels to suit the 10" racks at reasonable cost.
Any suggestions as to suppliers (both for panels and racks)? I had a look around for them a few weeks ago and didn't find many suppliers and those I found were quite expensive.

JD ]]> General Discussion jondye http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2832 to make or buy a cat5 gadget http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2840&goto=newpost Tue, 07 Sep 2010 12:05:13 GMT ---Quote (Originally by MrFluffy)--- Interestingly a rj11 will plug into a rj45 socket, so provided you use the right pair for the job, it stays...
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFluffy (Post 13062)
Interestingly a rj11 will plug into a rj45 socket, so provided you use the right pair for the job, it stays compatible with both ethernet and audio plugs ongoing.
Even more interesting but not widely known is that putting an RJ11 plug into an RJ45 scoket bends the contacts on the outer two pairs of the RJ45 beyond the normal bending that is applied by inserting an RJ45 because the plastic body of the RJ11 forces them upwards

You will find that you may well mess up the RJ45 for proper CAT5 usage at a later date. :( ]]> General Discussion katman http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2840 CBus Wireless http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2843&goto=newpost Mon, 06 Sep 2010 19:24:17 GMT I've just had a look at the CBus Shop website and noticed that all of the Saturn and Neo wireless relays and dimmers are showing as discontinued although still in stock.

Does anyone know if CBus are really discontinuing these ranges and if so are they being replaced by something else? ]]> CBus pholding http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2843 First steps with 1-wire sensors? http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2822&goto=newpost Mon, 06 Sep 2010 15:30:43 GMT ---Quote (Originally by MrFluffy)--- I did my last house in parasitic mode with cat5 for the wire, but I used one of these :-...
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFluffy (Post 13065)
I did my last house in parasitic mode with cat5 for the wire, but I used one of these :-
http://www.ibuttonlink.com/link45.aspx
It was bombproof, the only time the network gave issues was when there was a physical short on the bus, which brought the entire bus down of course until the short was eliminated.
I bought all my ibutton stuff direct from the states, it was cheaper than messing round. Ive got a bag somewhere of ds1820's to use on this place as I bought loads as they worked out so cheap that way (2.85 a sensor from looking at a old receipt).

In fact Im going to rescue it from the other house and fit it this one in a few weeks as we're replacing all the intelligent house stuff in there with dumb COTS products and the heating control system is being replaced by some dumb wall mounted bendy wire thermostats. Because at the end of the day having stupid old fashioned stuff controlling things that the estate agent can understand puts more value on your house when you sell it :(
Thanks for the thoughrs Mr Fluffy.

A quick update: I've received 3 DS18B20 temperature probes from Ebay (from Hong Kong) - I'm not convinced the sleeving is high temperature like the "proper" stainless items, but they were much cheaper, look neat enough and fit nicely into the temperature pockets on my DHW/solar cylinder. I have ordered a roll of pink C-bus CAT5E cable from http://www.gil-lec.co.uk/ as I don't want to use my fancy network cable for 1-wire, plus it could also be upgraded to Clipsal or IDRATEK later. Finally I spoke to Nigel at HomeChip who was very helpful and advised me to buy a Link USB (which is a Link 45 with a USB converter on the front & more reliable than the DS9490R apparently).

I haven't decided whether to use RJ12 or RJ45 plugs/sockets yet. I am ultimately expecting to have about a dozen or so temp sensors and so for the ones in rooms I'm planning to run the DQ/GND lines "down" one twisted pair (to a DS18B20 the back of a faceplate) and "back up" another in the same cable so that the sensor is not on a branch. I thought about buying a load of RJ45 or RJ12 couplers that I could open and solder the drop cable into (if you see what I mean!).

I take your point about removing HA stuff if you want to move house. I think the lack of standardisation in HA is a real challenge at the moment - almost whatever you do will end up being home-grown. My plan is to use 8 port UFH manifold (or maybe two 4 ports) with 24V actuators and probably a 8-channel DS2408-based unit (http://www.hobby-boards.com/catalog/...oducts_id=1554). If necessary you could just remove all the actuators and leave all zones permanently on. Control software is still a bit up in the air though... ]]> General Discussion Simon300 http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2822 Home Automation / Media Streaming - managed or unmanaged switch? http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2838&goto=newpost Mon, 06 Sep 2010 14:19:27 GMT I run streaming realtime tv over my lan (mythtv) and the main root switch is a old 100BT baynetworks managed switch, and wired from that are a few... I run streaming realtime tv over my lan (mythtv) and the main root switch is a old 100BT baynetworks managed switch, and wired from that are a few 100baset unmanaged cheapo switches where needed.
When my wife is watching a soap in the front room of the house, its being captured in mpeg in realtime from a sky satelite on a outbuilding to a pc racked in there, then comes across the infrastructure first passing the baynet then a smaller 100b unmanaed switch before it arrives in a atom micropc on the back of the tv.

Im saying in a roundabout way, that I doubt you'll stress a gigabit switch at all... Unless your going to try and stream hd blueray or something in realtime, at which point the bottleneck is likely to be the pc's performance to deal with the packet rate rather than the infrastructure... ]]> General Discussion MrFluffy http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2838 Vokera Unica 28HE Z Wave Heating Control http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2842&goto=newpost Sun, 05 Sep 2010 09:05:31 GMT Good job, but the photo could be a tiny bit bigger. When I click on it to enlarge it it doesn't get much bigger. ]]> Heating Control toscal http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2842 Electronic Thermostatic Radiator Valve System http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2839&goto=newpost Sat, 04 Sep 2010 20:08:06 GMT I was in a branch of Graham plumbers merchants last week and they had Pegler battery operated TRV's timer on the top type. No idea how good or dear though.
I also know Danfoss make Z wave actuators for standard Danfoss TRV body's From what I've read they might have a fair requirement fot batterys though. I fancy those for my system soon. Just for the hell of it really. ]]> Heating Control Wollo http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2839 Newbie, new house, new everything http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2825&goto=newpost Sat, 04 Sep 2010 10:13:40 GMT to answer my own question, the Wiki entry (Cables para') seems to highlight the key issues :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI

also :

http://www.1394ta.org/products/whyfirewire.html ]]> General Discussion chris_j_hunter http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2825